New developments in the Elaine Wynn versus Steve Wynn case? [RJ]
Here’s an article with insight from Aviva Gordon on why #metoo may have repercussions for women in the workplace. [RJ]
Judge Cadish denied a request to sanction the RJ for publishing the name of the man charged in connection with the October 1 shooting. [RJ]
A convicted pimp was accidentally released from jail–the I-team discovered that he got a pretty sweet plea deal and no one from the DA’s office will talk about it. [LasVegasNow]
Are FLDS contractors using child labor to underbid and get the job? [LasVegasNow]
The concerns raised in the Aviva Gordon article are legitimate. They apply not only to gender issues, but also to race and ethnicity. If an unrealistic hypervigilence is required in order to avoid accusation of some slight or impropriety, avoidance of potential accusers could become the only means to avoid accusation. And with the rules on what one cannot do or say in a state of constant change, the number of people deciding not to play the game will only increase.
There are limits to what qualifies as gender or cultural insensitivity. The problem is that that the limits are in constant change to the point that no one knows what he or she can or cannot say or do.
Complete BS. How about you not rape your secretary? Don't grope the female associates? Don't be a racist? Don't tell your firm's female attorneys they were hired to be the firm sex symbols? Don't make assumptions about people that are based on nothing more than their ethnicity or religion or gender? Ugh. So many rules. Don't know what to do. Must whine about the plight of the white, cis man. Boo hoo. If all that is to much for you, here's a rule: Don't be a dick to other people. That should be a good start.
Seriously. Treat people with respect. Don't be an asshole. Open your mind to the fact that their are other perspectives and experiences than yours and that some of those experiences are worth listening to and learning from. Don't cherry pick extreme examples of stupid people and then use those to claim that the #MeToo movement is as oppressive as decades of sexual and racial harassment. None of those things are hard assuming you put in the least bit of effort.
And if those are too hard, just follow the advice from medium.com and pretend your co-worker is The Rock. You'll be fine.
You absolutely demonstrate 8:53 AM's point, 10:56 AM.
If the line were drawn at raping secretaries and groping female associates, you'd have a legitimate point, 10:56 AM. But you know and I know that's not the line. These days you can't compliment a female about anything for fear of being branded an abuser and a predator. And you know that's true.
Yes, I'm male, I'm white, and I'm relatively successful. But I'm certainly not a dick. I have daughters and I certainly do not want them raped or groped. But I also don't want them so ridiculously sensitive that any words uttered to themem are interpreted as harassment.
As a successful white male I feel as though at all times I have a target on my face. And that feeling is justified. So I keep my mouth shut and I say as little as possible to my female colleagues; because I don't know where the line is drawn.
As a young white male partner in a small law firm who identifies as extremely liberal, I worry about the possibility of false allegations if a subordinate staff member or attorney were to be let go for cause. I won't avoid hiring a female attorney for this reason, but I understand this concern.
This movement is brand new and there are going to be unforeseen impacts. Probably wise to discuss these issues in order to solve the problems, rather than be dismissive and condescending.
If you wouldn't say it or do it in front of your mom, then don't do it at work. Also, don't shit where you eat. Stop trying to pick up chicks at work. Why is this such a hard concept for men to understand? Yes, I know women do it to, not all men, blah blah blah.
12:12 here. 12:54, My concern isn't that actual bad conduct will be fairly complained about. My concern is that an entirely false allegation will be made up as retribution after a termination for cause. Why is this such a hard concept for you to understand? I agree with your solution for men who are unsure of how to act (they are probably idiots to begin with). Your response ignores my concern. (it is also condescending and dismissive)
Oh, 11:59, you sweet summer child, is it really that confusing? Fuck off, you can't compliment a woman, about anything these days. Here are some helpful examples:
OK: "I thought your motion was really well written."
OK: "Congratulations on winning that trial. I know you put a lot of work into it."
OK: "I admire the way you were able to resolve that situation with the client. Your solution will save us all a lot of time and trouble.
NOT OK: "Boy, look at those legs. Your husband is a lucky man!"
NOT OK: "Good work with the client, I guess it's easier to make them them happy when they have a hot young thing handling the account."
NOT OK "Wow, you put a lot of extra time into that trial, I guess you're not winning Mother of the Year anytime soon."
So 11:59, could you tell the difference? You understand what's okay now? Or is it really that fucking difficult to learn what's appropriate?
10:56 here in response to 11:59 – I know that is not where the line is. That is why raping and groping were not my only examples. And, BTW, they were just examples. Some of which I myself have endured. If you actually read the article (which I am hoping you did since you're commenting here) you would see that the article talks about the possibility of a lack of mentoring available for young women because men are scared of how to act. That is a cop out and it is BS. I have worked with lots of men over the years who know exactly how to act around women (They even tell me dirty jokes! And we both laugh!!!) and to mentor women with being creepers. I refuse to accept that men cannot mentor women because they don't know how to act. I expect more of men and I know lots of men who meet or exceed my expectations everyday. The article is crap and the premise is crap. Men should be offended that they're being written off as ignorant, horny, uncontrolled beasts. Men are quite capable of being knowledgeable, horny, self-controlled beasts.
I wasn't necessarily responding to you, 1:03. But, it's not like being falsely accused is a new concept. We can all be accused of wrong doing, they are only allegations until proven. Of course it's wrong to falsely accuse someone, but most women aren't even reporting LEGIT claims. If you have an employee that isn't doing their job, document it. Email them or talk to them with another staff member in the room, there's plenty of options.
They are only allegations until proven? Come on, I know that you are smarter than that. Didn't you read that Shaun White set erection photos and feces fetish materials to his drummer (there is no evidence that happened, just allegations and yet it is widely reported as fact)? No, quite to the contrary, accusations get flung around all of the time that have no foundation and destroy just by the accusation being made.
I agree with you– there is bad conduct that does not get reported, either because the vicitim is scared or intimidated or just because the victim makes the conscious decision to let it go. That is unfortunate in both instances. But to pretend that false allegations do not happen and that there is no harm from false allegations being made is ill informed at best.
not nearly as simple as you want it to be 1:06 Is this OK ? "that's a very flattering suit (dress) you are wearing today" or this? "you look great, been working out?" Or any other innocent compliment on ones appearance?
To 10:56:I believe you pretend to misunderstand 8:53 so you can justify being morally indignant. When 8:53 points out that the rules are evolving at a pretty fast rate as to what is verbally acceptable to say in the work place, I believe 8:53(presumably) understands that it is not acceptable to rape his secretary, etc.
1:29 – If you think saying either of those to a colleague is okay then you truly need help with your interpersonal IQ. Why would you say either of those things to a woman you work with? What is to be gained? On the flip side, what could be lost? On balance, is it worth the risk? Would you say either of those things to her if your wife was standing next to you? Let's be honest, the only reason you'd say either of those things is to float the possibility of maybe someday sticking your dick in her.
Agree – proposed "compliments" by 1:29 totally creepy and unnecessary. Sounds like comments intentionally and carefully crafted to provide cover to claim innocence while putting a toe in the water to test the reaction and see if you can go further. And I am a conventionally attractive female who has worked with lots of successful men over the years who never made inappropriate comments to me despite plenty of raucous happy hours etc.
Guest
Anonymous
February 14, 2018 4:56 pm
It is nice to see that Elissa Cadish threw her staff under the bus for failing to redact Douglas Haig's, but her staff is supporting her in her campaign. SMH.
Which is interesting… If Cadish wins, and assuming Silver claims Las Vegas chambers, will Cadish's staff move with her to Carson? Or will they stay in the Eighth?
What in the Sam Hill he'll takes Tim and Cadish so long on singing stop and orders. I had to wait over 30 days for one. It is not rocket science. It was a one pager.
Correct me if I am wrong but isn't there limited palatial office space in the Hardesty Tomb of Gloom? I think it is already time to expand it so that they can have bigger chambers to not decide cases in.
What an excellent idea! But of course we'll need a study of square foot allocations for chambers per justice to see if we're keeping pace. Probably should start by comparing chambers size to SCOTUS.
Only took until the 11th paragraph of this POS release for them to stick a sentence in there about "An indictment merely alleges that crimes have been committed, and a defendant is presumed innocent until proven guilty beyond a reasonable doubt."
Apparently not if you read the other 150 sentences.
Yeah because most mass shooters are terrified of dying, right? Makes sense. Also, how many mass shooters are 3rd-time convicted felons? I'd venture to guess exactly zero.
Expelled students fear that the third time they go on a mass shooting rampage that it could be capital punishment. Plus since Florida does not already have capital punishment….
Criminals get too many privileges in prison and get out early. I know one murderer who only got 6 months jail. So yeah, build the wall, capital punishment… it is called accountability… not free skate ride.
The concerns raised in the Aviva Gordon article are legitimate. They apply not only to gender issues, but also to race and ethnicity. If an unrealistic hypervigilence is required in order to avoid accusation of some slight or impropriety, avoidance of potential accusers could become the only means to avoid accusation. And with the rules on what one cannot do or say in a state of constant change, the number of people deciding not to play the game will only increase.
There are limits to what qualifies as gender or cultural insensitivity. The problem is that that the limits are in constant change to the point that no one knows what he or she can or cannot say or do.
Complete BS. How about you not rape your secretary? Don't grope the female associates? Don't be a racist? Don't tell your firm's female attorneys they were hired to be the firm sex symbols? Don't make assumptions about people that are based on nothing more than their ethnicity or religion or gender? Ugh. So many rules. Don't know what to do. Must whine about the plight of the white, cis man. Boo hoo. If all that is to much for you, here's a rule: Don't be a dick to other people. That should be a good start.
Right on, 10:56. Tell these assholes where to head.
#metoo, law firms, so many to list, embarrassing.
Seriously. Treat people with respect. Don't be an asshole. Open your mind to the fact that their are other perspectives and experiences than yours and that some of those experiences are worth listening to and learning from. Don't cherry pick extreme examples of stupid people and then use those to claim that the #MeToo movement is as oppressive as decades of sexual and racial harassment. None of those things are hard assuming you put in the least bit of effort.
And if those are too hard, just follow the advice from medium.com and pretend your co-worker is The Rock. You'll be fine.
The Rock Test
You absolutely demonstrate 8:53 AM's point, 10:56 AM.
If the line were drawn at raping secretaries and groping female associates, you'd have a legitimate point, 10:56 AM. But you know and I know that's not the line. These days you can't compliment a female about anything for fear of being branded an abuser and a predator. And you know that's true.
Yes, I'm male, I'm white, and I'm relatively successful. But I'm certainly not a dick. I have daughters and I certainly do not want them raped or groped. But I also don't want them so ridiculously sensitive that any words uttered to themem are interpreted as harassment.
As a successful white male I feel as though at all times I have a target on my face. And that feeling is justified. So I keep my mouth shut and I say as little as possible to my female colleagues; because I don't know where the line is drawn.
As a young white male partner in a small law firm who identifies as extremely liberal, I worry about the possibility of false allegations if a subordinate staff member or attorney were to be let go for cause. I won't avoid hiring a female attorney for this reason, but I understand this concern.
This movement is brand new and there are going to be unforeseen impacts. Probably wise to discuss these issues in order to solve the problems, rather than be dismissive and condescending.
If you wouldn't say it or do it in front of your mom, then don't do it at work. Also, don't shit where you eat. Stop trying to pick up chicks at work. Why is this such a hard concept for men to understand? Yes, I know women do it to, not all men, blah blah blah.
12:12 here. 12:54, My concern isn't that actual bad conduct will be fairly complained about. My concern is that an entirely false allegation will be made up as retribution after a termination for cause. Why is this such a hard concept for you to understand? I agree with your solution for men who are unsure of how to act (they are probably idiots to begin with). Your response ignores my concern. (it is also condescending and dismissive)
Oh, 11:59, you sweet summer child, is it really that confusing? Fuck off, you can't compliment a woman, about anything these days. Here are some helpful examples:
OK: "I thought your motion was really well written."
OK: "Congratulations on winning that trial. I know you put a lot of work into it."
OK: "I admire the way you were able to resolve that situation with the client. Your solution will save us all a lot of time and trouble.
NOT OK: "Boy, look at those legs. Your husband is a lucky man!"
NOT OK: "Good work with the client, I guess it's easier to make them them happy when they have a hot young thing handling the account."
NOT OK "Wow, you put a lot of extra time into that trial, I guess you're not winning Mother of the Year anytime soon."
So 11:59, could you tell the difference? You understand what's okay now? Or is it really that fucking difficult to learn what's appropriate?
Your Congressman, Reuben Kihuen, harasses women. A production brought to you by Harry Reid and his buddies.
10:56 here in response to 11:59 – I know that is not where the line is. That is why raping and groping were not my only examples. And, BTW, they were just examples. Some of which I myself have endured. If you actually read the article (which I am hoping you did since you're commenting here) you would see that the article talks about the possibility of a lack of mentoring available for young women because men are scared of how to act. That is a cop out and it is BS. I have worked with lots of men over the years who know exactly how to act around women (They even tell me dirty jokes! And we both laugh!!!) and to mentor women with being creepers. I refuse to accept that men cannot mentor women because they don't know how to act. I expect more of men and I know lots of men who meet or exceed my expectations everyday. The article is crap and the premise is crap. Men should be offended that they're being written off as ignorant, horny, uncontrolled beasts. Men are quite capable of being knowledgeable, horny, self-controlled beasts.
I wasn't necessarily responding to you, 1:03. But, it's not like being falsely accused is a new concept. We can all be accused of wrong doing, they are only allegations until proven. Of course it's wrong to falsely accuse someone, but most women aren't even reporting LEGIT claims. If you have an employee that isn't doing their job, document it. Email them or talk to them with another staff member in the room, there's plenty of options.
They are only allegations until proven? Come on, I know that you are smarter than that. Didn't you read that Shaun White set erection photos and feces fetish materials to his drummer (there is no evidence that happened, just allegations and yet it is widely reported as fact)? No, quite to the contrary, accusations get flung around all of the time that have no foundation and destroy just by the accusation being made.
I agree with you– there is bad conduct that does not get reported, either because the vicitim is scared or intimidated or just because the victim makes the conscious decision to let it go. That is unfortunate in both instances. But to pretend that false allegations do not happen and that there is no harm from false allegations being made is ill informed at best.
not nearly as simple as you want it to be 1:06 Is this OK ? "that's a very flattering suit (dress) you are wearing today" or this? "you look great, been working out?" Or any other innocent compliment on ones appearance?
To 10:56:I believe you pretend to misunderstand 8:53 so you can justify being morally indignant. When 8:53 points out that the rules are evolving at a pretty fast rate as to what is verbally acceptable to say in the work place, I believe 8:53(presumably) understands that it is not acceptable to rape his secretary, etc.
1:29 – If you think saying either of those to a colleague is okay then you truly need help with your interpersonal IQ. Why would you say either of those things to a woman you work with? What is to be gained? On the flip side, what could be lost? On balance, is it worth the risk? Would you say either of those things to her if your wife was standing next to you? Let's be honest, the only reason you'd say either of those things is to float the possibility of maybe someday sticking your dick in her.
1:29 dates his married sectretaries.
Secretaries
I am waiting for Steve Wolfson to weigh in on this.
Agree – proposed "compliments" by 1:29 totally creepy and unnecessary. Sounds like comments intentionally and carefully crafted to provide cover to claim innocence while putting a toe in the water to test the reaction and see if you can go further. And I am a conventionally attractive female who has worked with lots of successful men over the years who never made inappropriate comments to me despite plenty of raucous happy hours etc.
It is nice to see that Elissa Cadish threw her staff under the bus for failing to redact Douglas Haig's, but her staff is supporting her in her campaign. SMH.
Which is interesting… If Cadish wins, and assuming Silver claims Las Vegas chambers, will Cadish's staff move with her to Carson? Or will they stay in the Eighth?
No one other than Cadish is going to hire Tim. He is her personal JEA so he either goes with her or probably does not have a job in EJDC.
No one would want him. He is an a-hole bully.
What in the Sam Hill he'll takes Tim and Cadish so long on singing stop and orders. I had to wait over 30 days for one. It is not rocket science. It was a one pager.
Stip
With the new Hardesty Palace of Justice in Las Vegas, why would anyone move to Carson?
Correct me if I am wrong but isn't there limited palatial office space in the Hardesty Tomb of Gloom? I think it is already time to expand it so that they can have bigger chambers to not decide cases in.
What an excellent idea! But of course we'll need a study of square foot allocations for chambers per justice to see if we're keeping pace. Probably should start by comparing chambers size to SCOTUS.
So long as Hardesty's is at least 1 square foot bigger than everyone else's chambers.
Looks like Dr. Holper was indicted:
https://www.justice.gov/usao-nv/pr/las-vegas-doctor-arrested-and-charged-29-counts-unlawful-distribution-fentanyl-and-health
Good.
Only took until the 11th paragraph of this POS release for them to stick a sentence in there about "An indictment merely alleges that crimes have been committed, and a defendant is presumed innocent until proven guilty beyond a reasonable doubt."
Apparently not if you read the other 150 sentences.
I'm sure the U.S. Attorney will find a way to screw it up somehow, but this has been a long time coming.
Another senseless shooting. I guess we've just resigned to dealing with this on a regular basis?
Thoughts and prayers!
Start implementing death penalty and adopt California's 3 strikes your out….and it won't be regular anymore.
Yeah because most mass shooters are terrified of dying, right? Makes sense. Also, how many mass shooters are 3rd-time convicted felons? I'd venture to guess exactly zero.
Expelled students fear that the third time they go on a mass shooting rampage that it could be capital punishment. Plus since Florida does not already have capital punishment….
Please, it's too early to politicize this. Let us pray. We can debate gun control when clearer heads can prevail.
Oh, an immigrant drove drunk and killed somebody? Build the wall now!
Criminals get too many privileges in prison and get out early. I know one murderer who only got 6 months jail. So yeah, build the wall, capital punishment… it is called accountability… not free skate ride.
Jesus Christ. How am I just now realizing that non-lawyers actively comment on this site?? At least I'm hoping 7:18 isn't a lawyer.
7:18, why do you know a murderer? Also, why do you find it hard to stay on topic?
Attorney Greg Marsh died. I know its 2 weeks old but I just saw it.
https://www.afterlife.co/us/obituary-las-vegas-greg-marsh-6915935